Celebration V Guest List: Gary Kurtz Is Showing Up?

[lazypadawan]

Let's see, a few days ago we found out that Anthony Daniels will be taking a break from Star Wars In Concert to drop by Celebration; I couldn't imagine the guy missing it.

Then Official Pix jumped the gun by announcing Gary Kurtz as a guest before he formally signed on the dotted line; the announcement was quickly pulled but Philip Wise posted on Rebelscum's forum that for all intents and purposes, Kurtz will be there. Plus he promised a forthcoming announcement on an "oh, cool, he's signing??!" kind of guest. Uh, who could that be?

Kurtz did appear at Celebration IV and he's appeared at cons in Europe for years but I think this is the first time he'll be in the same building as Papa George at like the same time in ages :O. Interesting.

Comments

[may-child.livejournal.com]

Oh, yay. Gary "I Was Lucas's Babysitter" Kurtz showing up at a celebration, no doubt to further exploit Lucas Derangement Syndrome and stir up the bedwetters. Hopefully he won't have the bad taste to cast himself as Lennon to Lucas's McCartney while Lucas himself is there, but then, Kurtz has been pretty shameless in the way he's bashed the SEs (feeding into the ridiculous "moral outrage" over Greedo shooting first), "confirmed" that TPM is full of racist stereotypes, and claimed that the PT "sucks" because "Lucas surrounds himself with fawning yes-men." Bedwetters worship that self-important butt-wipe, and use circular logic to both render his word unimpeachable ("He's never been caught in a lie like Lucas has") and to "prove" that he "kept all the childish and silly stuff out of ANH and ESB" ("When he stopped being SW's producer, we got Ewoks, Jar Jar, and poop and fart jokes").

I'm not enthused. I wish Kurtz would just shut his self-aggrandizing face, and return to the obscurity that he, "the real talent and genius behind ANH and ESB," has languished in for the past 20-odd years. FGS, he was such an inept producer that Jim Henson wanted to remove his name from the credits for "The Dark Crystal," and Lucas -- yes, Lucas, who Kurtz supposedly "babysat" -- had to step in and save "Return to Oz" from being shut down...the director, Walter Murch, never forgot how Lucas personally convinced the bigwigs at Disney to let the filming continue even though Kurtz's incompetence had resulted in it going badly over-budget and off-schedule. Murch talked about it some 20 years later in an interview, and not once did he mention Gary "Genius" Kurtz. Nor, for that matter, does Irvin Kershner when talking about ESB, though according to bedwetter folklore, Kurtz "protected" Kersh from Lucas and "collaborated" with Kersh to "make ESB great behind Lucas's back."

Of course, the loathsome Chris Gore, aka Professional PT Basher Extraordinaire, introduced Kurtz as "the man behind ANH and ESB and the classics 'The Dark Crystal' and 'Return to Oz.'" Say wha-? Could Gore's nose have been any browner? Good Lord I detest him.

[sabreman64.livejournal.com]

I pretty much agree with everything you said there.

You know the anti-Lucas fanboys who disliked Indy IV? As far as they're concerned, Lucas is to blame for the film's "failure". Er, remind me who the director of the film was. Someone by the name of Spielberg, wasn't it? If the film were a failure, wouldn't a lot of the blame fall on Spielberg's shoulders? Stupid fanboys.

[may-child.livejournal.com]

Yep...if Lucas is even marginally involved in a project, it's his fault if it fails. (Conversely, he's given little to no credit if a project he's involved in succeeds.) He was more than marginally involved Indy IV, and it was NOT a failure, but still, the irate, bitchy, whiny bedwetters focus their ire on him. When Frank Darabont's rejected Indy IV script, aka The Best Movie Script Ever Written (that's sarcasm), was leaked and "Vanity Fair" did a story about it, all the blame for Indy IV's supposed "failure" was placed on Lucas; the writer dragged in a Jar Jar dis to prove it.

When Shia "Drunk-Driving Moron" LeBoeuf (sp?) decided to kiss up to the bedwetters by voicing his "disapproval" of Indy IV at Cannes, he never once mentioned Lucas, but the bedwetters, and Darth Media, immediately added Lucas's name or substituted it for Spielberg's when circulating/discussing the story.

[sabreman64.livejournal.com]

Seeing as you mentioned Frank Darabont, were you aware that Darabont had positive things to say about The Phantom Menace and its script back in 2000? Here's a link:

http://www.starwarz.com/tbone/index.php?categoryid=26&p2_articleid=168

[may-child.livejournal.com]

Yes, I was aware, but thanks for the link. :-)

[lazypadawan.livejournal.com]

Wow, I don't think I've seen that before or I plum forgot! I'll link to it at SWPAS. Thanks!

[may-child.livejournal.com]

In case you were thinking that I was snarking at Darabont, I wasn't. I was snarking at the bedwetters and their representatives in Darth Media who treated his Indy IV script like the greatest script ever written.

[darth-pipes.livejournal.com]

If Kurtz was so great a producer, he would have done a hell of a lot more over the last thirty years since ESB. If he were so great, somebody would have gotten him to produce their films. It's very revealing that no one has.

[may-child.livejournal.com]

But don't you know that Kurtz was the secret director of ANH, which is why it doesn't suck TOO badly, and bedwetters don't hate on it as much as they do ROTJ and the prequels?

At least, that's according to a particularly fetid bedwetter, whose user name was Darth_Insidious if I recall correctly, that was my nemesis back when I could still post on TheForce.net's message board. I asked the jackass how he knew that, and he replied, "From the horse's mouth -- Gary Kurtz himself."

Uh...I would think the horse's mouth, collectively speaking, would belong to the actors: Mark Hamill, Carrie Fisher, and the famously blunt-spoken Harrison Ford, who has NEVER been shy about voicing his opinions of what he considers Lucas's deficiencies as a writer or director. But none of them have ever, in 30-odd years, said or even implied that Kurtz was their "secret" director on the set of ANH. In fact, they scarcely mention him at all. The only time I can remember one of them referring to him was when Carrie Fisher spoke about her famous bralessness in ANH -- a bra would have been visible under her white dress, and Lucas didn't want that. But for running scenes, he ordered that her breasts be bound with gaffer's tape. Quoth Ms. Fisher: "Gary Kurtz had to tell me that. George didn't have the nerve."

Side note -- I can just picture Lucas trying to utter the word "breasts": "Um...we have to tape down her, uh...you know, those uh..." ;-P

[mark-pierre.livejournal.com]

I must admit I enjoy your Gary Kurtz rants, because I have as much respect for him as for that guy who wrote "The secret history of SW" - that is none.
:)

[lazypadawan.livejournal.com]

Oh man, you've seen that silly thing? The guy who wrote it should have called it "I Prove Lucas Lied About Everything!!1!!" because that's basically all it is.

[(Anonymous)]

I remember him making some comment about whether or not J.W. Rinzler's The Making of Star Wars was "up to par". This guy was talking about the book like HE ALONE was the expert on all things Star Wars; it wasn't accurate unless it jived with his version of events. I was sitting there thinking to myself, Buddy, who the heck do you think you are??? He's also accused Carrie Fisher of engaging in revisionist history when she talks about how her performance in the OT wasn't looked upon as fondly by critics as it is today. In other words, he knows better than Carrie fucking Fisher.

His smug arrogance is just astounding.

[may-child.livejournal.com]

Ms. Fisher's performance WASN'T looked upon as fondly by critics when the movie came out, as it is today. In fact, it wasn't looked upon as fondly by critics when the SEs were released, as it is today. It wasn't until the prequels came out that the critics started loving her performance. They were doing a juggling act of glorifying Carrie Fisher's performances in the OT movies at Natalie Portman's expense, while absolving Ms. Portman herself of all responsibility for being "awful" -- that was Lucas's fault, he "ruined" her.

I'm no fan of Ms. Portman...but it was patently absurd to see critics rewrite history and glorify Ms. Fisher when, at the time the OT was released, and for some time after, she was dismissed as marginally talented at best, and her performances in the OT were "shrill and nagging." Ms. Fisher was baffled by the 180 degree turnaround: "Now I'm a comedienne. I'm Carole Lombard. Before I was 'bovine' and 'had the worst qualities of both my parents.'" (Meaning, of course, her real-life parents, Eddie Fisher and Debbie Reynolds.) She'd said many times over the years that "a lot of people don't like Leia, they think she's a bitch."

Kurtz needs to a) get over himself; and b) shut his damn pie hole. Smug arrogance -- that's the perfect description of his persona. No wonder he and the loathsome Chris Gore got along so well.

[mark-pierre.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I have. I wanted to know what I'm bashing... ;)
What is really sad, that official fansites are actually promoting that piece of crap... :|

[sabreman64.livejournal.com]

I almost bought that Secret History of Star Wars book a few months ago. I'm glad I didn't now. Thanks for warning me. I'll avoid it.

Are there any unauthorised books on Star Wars that are worth buying?

[lazypadawan.livejournal.com]

You mean behind-the-scenes type stuff?

[sabreman64.livejournal.com]

Yes, I suppose. I have the book Anticipation by Jonathan Bowen, and I'm planning to buy his book Revenge soon. I was wondering what other decent unauthorised books of that type there are.

[may-child.livejournal.com]

I must admit I enjoy your Gary Kurtz rants, because I have as much respect for him as for that guy who wrote "The secret history of SW" - that is none.
:)

Why thank you. :-)

By the by, one thing Kurtz Kultists, as I call them, don't want you to know is that in an interview given by Kurtz during the time he was SW's producer, he said, and I quote, that it was the duty of the producer to get the director what he wanted. That's a rather strange utterance from a guy we're supposed to think was a "gutsy, tough-talking no-man" as opposed to the "fawning, butt-kissing yes-men" we're supposed to think Lucas surrounds himself with now. And an observer who wrote an article around the same time said, "When Lucas talks, Kurtz listens."

So methinks that Mr. Kurtz, shall we say, misremembers what he actually did back then when he implies/says he was Lucas's "babysitter" who "forced him to care about quality."

Or, in less polite terms, he's a lying, opportunistic, self-serving asshat.

"The Secret History of 'Star Wars'". *snort* Its real (albeit much longer) title should be: "What The Know-It-All Loser Who Wrote This Waste Of Time Wishes Was The Secret History Of 'Star Wars,' So He Could Go On Blaming George Lucas For Destroying His So-Called Life."

[mark-pierre.livejournal.com]

It's always mind boggling when someone you helped stabs you in the back... which is exactly what Kurtz does... I think the guy have a serious inferiority complex.

lying, opportunistic, self-serving asshat.
I might make a Kurtz icon with that text... :)

[may-child.livejournal.com]

Yeah...and it's interesting how Kurtz only came forward with his version of history AFTER the backlash against TPM had started. Opportunistic, like I said. Lucas has shown remarkable tolerance for Kurtz's diarrhea of the mouth and insulting accusations, even allowing him to speak on the "Empire of Dreams" documentary when the OT DVD set came out.

According to Kurtz, Lucas chose Richard Marquand to direct ROTJ because he wanted a "lapdog," because he'd been so frustrated with Kersh refusing to do it his way on the set of ESB. First of all, how would Kurtz even know Lucas's reasons for choosing Marquand? He wasn't involved in the process of choosing a director for ROTJ! He'd stopped being Lucas's producer by then! Bedwetters "prove" that he must have been involved with the process of choosing a director by posting photographs Kurtz took on the set of ROTJ. Uh...yeah. I'm not seeing the connection.

Second of all, Lucas ALLOWED Kersh a great deal of creative freedom in making ESB...Kersh was quite grateful for it, 20 years later, in an interview with SW Insider. The amount, and severity, of disagreements between Kersh and Lucas while ESB was being filmed have been grossly exaggerated.

Third of all, Lucas asked Kersh back to direct ROTJ, and Kersh said no. When I told this to a bedwetter who was babbling about how ESB was great because Kersh, and Kurtz, kept Lucas out of it as much as possible, the bedwetter got around it by saying, "Well, Kersh probably said no because he knew Kurtz was no longer the producer and wouldn't be protecting him from Lucas." Wait, I thought Kurtz was on the set of ROTJ, which proves...I'm not sure what. Oh, never mind. In any case, the reason Kersh gave for not directing ROTJ was because the shoot for ESB had been very stressful, and he felt that directing one SW movie in a lifetime was plenty.

Fourth of all, Lucas went on to allow Marquand a great deal of creative freedom in making ROTJ, as he had Kersh in making ESB. And finally, Lucas's reasons for choosing Marquand were a mix of needing to get a director attached to the project so it could go forward; he wasn't going to helm it because the shoot for ANH nearly killed him, and since SW was not guild, he had a small pool of directors to choose from. He offered it to David Lynch, who turned him down. Steven Spielberg was unable to do it because he was guild. Lucas had met Marquand a year or so before...he wasn't guild, plus Lucas was impressed with his knowledge of SW lore. So he chose Marquand.

I would be very flattered if you made a Kurtz icon with my quote. :-) Your icons are great.

[darth-pipes.livejournal.com]

That's right, I forgot that GL offered the ROTJ director's job to David Lynch and Steve Spielberg. Those two guys aren't exactly lapdogs, especially Spielberg.

[may-child.livejournal.com]

Nope, they aren't. Lynch turned Lucas down because he wanted to make Dune and also because he felt he wouldn't have been given as much creative freedom as he wanted. The you-know-who predictably pounced on that last, and it's possible he was correct in his belief...but considering how much creative freedom Lucas gave Kersh, and, more to the point, Marquand, it's just as possible he was incorrect.

Speaking of Marquand...I know I've said this before, but ever notice how the you-know-who tore him to shreds as a no-telent "lapdog of Luca$" -- but suddenly became passionate defenders of him and his "artistic rights" with regards to the SE version of ROTJ? You'd think that they'd have been happy that some Ewok footage was cut out of the ending and replaced with galactic celebration footage, given how much they bitch about Ewoks, but no...they screamed about Lucas "desecrating" the movie (which was their favorite punching bag before the prequels started coming out) and wailed that, since Marquand is dead, he cannot approve or disapprove of the changes made to "his movie."

Which brings me to another thing I know I've said before...one of the most outlandish conspiracy theories I've seen bedwetters spin around Lucas is that he waited so long to put the OT on DVD because he hoped the elderly Irvin Kershner would die, and thus be unable to do the director's commentary (Marquand, "conveniently," was already dead). That's patently absurd, and I pointed out that if Lucas didn't want Kersh to do the commentary, all he'd have to do is say, "Kersh, you're not doing the commentary." Bedwetter response: "But that would make him look bad. If he just waited until Kersh died, then Kersh would automatically be excluded."

Oh good LORD...there are just no words.

[mark-pierre.livejournal.com]

I think I've read, watch or heard of almost everything that has been posted here, yet... it was so long ago I've completely forgot about that... It's good to have you around to remind us of those facts. :D

[may-child.livejournal.com]

Aw, stop, I'm blushing. ;-) In all honesty, when the name "Gary Kurtz" is mentioned, it's difficult for me to keep my fingers off my keyboard, because I feel compelled to remind everyone what I think of him. Again. :-P

Thanks for saying your piece, too.

[may-child.livejournal.com]

Oh, and I just have to get the following petty, nasty little snark in...Kurtz also had the stupidest-looking beard I've ever seen. I hear he's shaved it off since; he's done at least ONE thing right in the 20-odd years he's languished in obscurity.

[darth-eldritch.livejournal.com]

With all the drama that's happened off screen over the years, it's no wonder George Lucas divorced himself from Hollywood. It was a very good move on his part.